How Awayday Is Scaling Without Losing Local Identity, with CEO Jakob Dwyer

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Join them as they highlight those real stories behind the people and brands that have built vacation rentals into the$100 billion industry used today.

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And now it's time to get real and have some fun with your host, Alex Danny.

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Welcome to Alex Danny, the real woman of vacation rentals.

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I'm Alex and I'm Annie.

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And we are joined today with Jacob Dwyer, who is the CEO of Away Day.

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Jacob, so good to see you.

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Yeah, nice to be on.

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Thank you, everybody.

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Yeah, so it's great to finally meet you.

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Um, heard a lot about you.

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You're actually just down the road from me over in Dustin.

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I'm in the Panama City Beach area.

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So kind of share some beautiful beaches together.

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But um, before we get started and talk about away day, why don't you give us a little bit about your history?

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Because you've done a lot of things and you've been in the industry a lot longer than obviously we knew about.

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So love to hear your story.

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Sure.

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Um yeah, so this is really all I have done in my professional career.

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Um, when I got out of college, I uh I got my CPA license and I was working in public accounting and consulting for small to medium-sized businesses.

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And, you know, I was in charge of going out and growing our business.

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And one of those customers ended up being Real Joy Vacations.

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And so this is like circa 2013, uh, 13, early 14 timeframe.

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Real Joy managed anywhere between like probably 50 and 90 properties at this point.

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It was Micah, Berg, uh, another gentleman named Danny, who's who's on our team now at away day.

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And, you know, I would say like they had a big dream and were really working to figure it out.

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Whenever I looked, you know, at this business from the outside, uh, I was like, there was like a few characteristics that I thought were just really cool.

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One, being from the beach market and from the panhandle, I just understood there's a lot of these condos everywhere.

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Um as I as I dug into the business, I was really impressed by, and this is kind of when people started talking about the cloud and technologies and impact.

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I was just really surprised that there wasn't like technology that was impacting this industry at that time.

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And um, and I just knew that was gonna shift a little bit.

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I I shared with you two earlier, Alex and Annie, that you know, on my day one with real joy, our third lead source was probably Craigslist.

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First was uh Flipkey, then then after Flipkey was probably Virgo or VRBO um at the time, and and then and then Craigslist.

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And so I knew that wasn't gonna go on like that for forever.

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Uh the third one, and probably the one that I was most excited about, if you were to ask my wife, um, pretty, you know, pretty nerdy about it, was that this business your customers pay you in advance.

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And you know, being in a business where you don't have to go chase receivables and people go on vacations and plan those six months out, and you have a cash flow cycle where you can get paid ahead of time.

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I knew that that was gonna be just really critical and important for a growing business and one that was gonna, you know, need to fuel itself.

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And so that those those things were all really excited to me.

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And I also believe that uh, you know, things all work out for for the better.

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And it was a little bit, you know, you know, there's some divine work for me meeting Micah and coming in and having a seat at the table and taking an equity stake in the business and and helping grow it.

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So over that time, we grew that business from you know, rum and noodles and just trying to survive to about 1200 properties.

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And, you know, that was probably about 40-ish million dollars in revenue at that time.

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Real joy.

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Real joy is still a super successful, exciting business.

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I sometimes joke around that, like it finally took off whenever I stopped working on it on a daily to day basis until it's in.

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So you know, there's there's a ton of people at Real Joy that are doing such a great job, but I think it's got like 1,700 or 1800 properties in our management today.

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It's still growing by like 15 to 20 percent each year, new unit count.

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It's got very high guest review scores.

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I mean, it's just a great business.

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And so at the peak of COVID, I I kind of understood that like, like, you know, this would be a good time if we were ever going to want to transact and get some outside capital to go do more, that this was a good point in time.

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And so I reached out to Micah and we had that conversation.

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And Micah was also looking, looking at retiring a little bit or at least stepping out of the vacation rental business, and he agreed.

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And so we went and we partnered with a private equity group called Light Bay.

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And Light Bay has been a phenomenal partner to us over the course of like the last four to five years.

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I generally like uh partners who who who have good swim lanes, and I think that's what Light Bay and now Aries and in a way they do really, really well is we focus on what we focus on and they focus on what they focus on.

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We overlap.

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Light Bay had an investment in a company called Villager Reality, and and that was Bob Oakes' business.

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And um, so you know, they were it's so the business as it came together was predominantly a southeast business with uh some markets in Colorado, but I would say like the the villager reality and the real joy business uh could not be any different, right?

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So like one was like 95% direct bookings, and one was like 90 or probably like 70, 60, 70 OTA driven business.

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One was heavy list.

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Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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One one was one was heavy technology use, and one was kind of this is how you know this is North Carolina.

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We we've done it this way for a long time.

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And so really merging those two cultures together was was a lot of fun and and and it's been a great success.

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And that business has continued to grow.

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So now we have this like 2400, 2500 unit platform between between folding the the businesses together.

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And um, and what we figured out at Real Joy is we started to, and I should have gone backwards, but what we what we what we started to do in probably 16 and 17 was partner with businesses outside of the panhandle.

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Um, the first one was a business down in St.

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Pete Beach.

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And what we learned is you could go and partner with a really good business, leave it locally branded, locally run, but centrally supported, and you can have a really great outcome.

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And uh several, like that was our first real partnership or acquisition.

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And there was employees that had been there at that point for 20, 25 years, and they're still with us, which is the real coolest thing.

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And so and and uh and I remember having the conversation with them like, well, you know, what are you gonna tell us to do?

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I'm like, you've been doing this for 25 years, you're gonna tell me what to do, you know, and that really started to cement kind of our cultural philosophy is that we don't sit above these businesses, we sit below them and we help to push them forward, not tell them what to do.

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And so as we partnered with Light Bay, you know, we wanted to do a lot more of that.

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And that's been our philosophy ever since.

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And so as you roll that forward um four or five years by from now, you know, we've partnered with probably 50-ish businesses across the you know country.

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We and we have the exact same philosophy.

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We're not gonna tell you what to do, we're gonna enable you to do what you do better.

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And it's been a it's been a great outcome.

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I'd say, like, if I roll backwards a little bit, Ryan Olin, Jim Olin's son, and you know, part of the you know, the legacy of the vacation rental industry uh joined us in 2000 and 17.

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And that was just a great addition and catapulted us forward.

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And he's and Ryan continues to run business development, which we'll get into today, is a great part of our business.

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And um, and then we built a leadership team at away day that's that's done a fantastic job of of taking the business forward that we can we can talk for talk through.

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But I probably left a bunch of things out there and happy to roll back or step forward and and tell the story.

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Oh, personally, it's really it's really important for me.

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I have a bunch of kids.

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I have six kids and oh wow, yeah.

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So like generally a pretty busy life, which leads me to also say, like, just have an amazing wife that that that has that does the real work, you know, out of the two of us in in helping and to lead and rate raise them.

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And uh, and so if I'm not working, that's I'm usually spending time with with my family, which is which is a big part of who I am.

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So I'm I love that.

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Yeah, that's great.

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Yeah, you you've got to be a very busy guy then with both the business and the kids.

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And doesn't Ryan have a bunch of kids too?

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Yeah, Ryan has four kids.

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I think as you go around away day, we are a very family-first business, and so it's just part of who we are as a culture.

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So um, we do a company off site every summer, and we incur we do three company offsites a year.

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And the one we do at the end of the summer, we encourage people to bring their families.

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And so last year in Park City, we probably had 30-ish kids from away day that were all playing together at parks and doing fun things.

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There was there was also some some boyfriend and girlfriends that like left that came not boyfriend and girlfriends, and left left with matchmakers.

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So yeah.

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Yeah, that's cool.

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Oh my goodness.

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Well, that's that's yeah, it's been fascinating just watching the growth of of what you've built through away day and just kind of seeing more conferences and hearing, you know, the different businesses that are coming into this.

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But um being from the panhandle and and the market that you're in, you you get for that long at least, like you really get used to how an area does business.

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And I think you know, Myrtle Beach is is similar in how we operate to the panhandle, that it's it is a lot of condos and it is different than an Outer Banks or a Hilton Head.

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But uh, what's been some of the other surprises that you've seen going into other markets of like how different the world can be outside of your bubble?

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I know for me when when I was with Cossigo, like going and seeing operators across the country, I I thought I knew everything about this business.

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And then I realized, wow, like there people do it very differently depending on their type of inventory and their location than what I was used to.

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I would I would say that we have a very humble style as an organization.

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That's what we hire for.

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You know, one of the one of the key things that we hire for is humility.

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And the reason why that's important and answering your question is that you need to approach every situation with the idea that you don't know what you're talking about, right?

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You don't I can't tell you what it's like to hire somebody in Summit County, Colorado.

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I can't tell you, you know, the challenges that someone faces trying to find affordable housing in Steamboat.

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I just can't.

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Right.

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It's up to you, and that's up to your local environment.

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And so, you know, I think a big part of a way day is we approach every partnership as an opportunity to learn from them.

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And and there's a lot of ways that this has come out.

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Is I'll never forget, you know, RealJoy historically had like a 4.4 guest review score, and we thought that was awesome.

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We're like, oh, this is so exciting.

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We it'd be on our walls internally.

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And then as we started to partner with businesses that did it better than us, we we was like, oh, there's people out here that have 4.9 and 4.8 guest review scores all the time.

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All right, team, that's the new goal, that's the new standard of the business.

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And they looked at us like we were crazy, but guess what?

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Real joy's average guest review score is now.

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It's now on the four sevens, four eights, depending on the the area, which is which is an awesome testament.

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Um, we partnered with a business down in South Florida, and I was so impressed.

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You know, we came back and we were like, hey, these people will jump across their desk before they let an owner phone call go unanswered.

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Like they like it's just part of their it's part of their DNA.

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They don't miss an owner phone call, they're owner obsessed.

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And so then we brought that back and that gets deployed across the whole system.

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And so I don't know that answers your question, but but there's a lot more learning that happens as we go and partner with these businesses, and it still happens every day than telling and showing.

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Um, and I think it's just a part of kind of the fabric of who we are as an organization.

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Yeah.

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So what um I'm curious when you decided that growth was the opportunity, what was it about, I guess, assessing or identifying a partner that would be right for where you wanted to take the business?

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Yeah, real joy grew from basically zero to 1200 properties in seven years.

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And so I would say like growth was always in our veins.

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Um, it's it was probably it it it consumed most of our thoughts, um, maybe a little bit too much.

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And so, you know, uh, in some ways, a way day probably looks and feels like an overnight success.

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And in a lot of ways, it's actually like 15 years in the making.

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And so that's actually how I think about it.

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And people will ask me, like, well, what keeps you up at night?

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I was like, there was there was Christmases where I was putting money in with Ryan and Micah just to make payroll, you know, so our people could have Christmas bonuses.

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Like, I don't have those fears anymore.

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And like, so thankfully, you know, and so um, and so like nothing really, nothing really keeps us up.

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But to answer your question, I'd say there's like four-ish things that that are always pretty, pretty relevant when we're looking for for for for partners.

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And these are the things that make us and them most successful.

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Number number one is is the right people.

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Um, I've you know, it's not my saying, but it's one I use a lot is you can't do a good deal with a bad person, right?

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And so, like making sure you're partnering with the right people, and that's just not that that's in a lot of ways.

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And so when we go and meet people in their business, I'm I'm looking at how they treat their employees, how their employees talk to them.

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You know, somebody that if I if I was to go walk into our laundry center here at Realjoy, there'd probably be like one or two people I'd give a hug to.

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And so is that that type of relationship that you have with the people who work for you, you know, and that's that's an important element.

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Now, number two, what what is the culture locally of that business?

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Are they excited about growth?

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Are they are they excited about are they customer obsessed?

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Do they constantly think about how to improve the the guest and owner experience?

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Are we because because really that's a cult, that's that's what a way day is.

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So that's a cultural alignment.

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If that's what they're centered about and that's where we're centered around, then that's gonna be a really good fit.

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If someone's like, hey, I don't care about an owner, I don't care about a guest, or I don't care about guest review scores, or I'm not excited about growth, it's probably not gonna be a good outcome for us.

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And so we choose not to go down that path.

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So that's that's number two.

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Number, number number three is so so number one is the right people.

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Number two is is cultural alignment.

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Number three is aligned incentives, and we can we can go through this a little bit more later, but like at a, you know, so Wayday is is a is roughly a 30% management owned business, which is pretty unique in private equity land, meaning that we, that the people that run the business own 30% and growing of the business, and it grows, you know, every month.

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And um, and that's a pretty unique aspect.

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And so part of that is also because we like it to be very culturally aligned.

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So if you come into our business through a role equity, is what we call a partner, like that's one way to get equity in the business.

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Another way is is we we set aside, I think it's about 25, it could be 26 million dollars for everyday local leaders, operators, revenue managers, uh accountants participate in these types of programs.

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So we want everybody to feel like owners and operate like owners of the business because we think that that's really critical.

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And so financial incentives and financial alignment is really important for us because you know what we say internally is you know, we're we're all on a boat, rowing together at a common speed, you know, in a common direction towards a common goal, right?

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And so that's just financial alignment with with partners is really really really important.

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And then and then the the next one is we all believe that this is a doubleable business, meaning like, you know, you get we we have a plan, we we execute on that plan, and the business is going to be larger in three years than it is today.

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And um, I don't know what the stat is as of right now, but as of like a few months ago, the average business we partnered with is like 56% larger today than what it was when we partnered with it at any time over the last three or four years.

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I don't think that's a common statistic amongst our industry.

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Um and and in fact, we haven't really had any, we don't really have a business that's worse off today than what it was when we partnered with it financially or from a unit count or from people.

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So so I think you know that that's the world we live in.

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And so those are the four, those are the four-ish things.

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I hope I said four things, but those are the four things that that that that that we were looking for.

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Yeah, no, that that makes sense.

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And so the 30%.

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So if a company sells their business to you, they do they have that option if they just want to exit completely, or they you you want them to stay?

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We we we want them to stay.

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I mean, you know, the tagline we use is like we're a founder-led business of founders.

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Um, you know, and that's that's that's the reality.

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We have, I think there's over 30 or 40 of these folks in our business that that that uh built a business and stayed on to help run that business with us.

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And but there's also a handful or more of businesses that were the founder just wanted to retire, or maybe the founder has retired since then.

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Um, you know, coming out of our last transaction, we returned as much as 3.68 times people's money.

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And so you put a million dollars into the business, you you got almost four million dollars out of the business, right?

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And so, so there's a lot of folks who who did better on on the upside of the world equity than they did on their initial transaction of the business.

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So a few of those people decided to retire, which which is great.

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We have a system of building talent for people to come in behind them.

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And so, yeah, it's it's it's a good mix.

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I mean, I I'll give you uh the three examples is one, you want to partner with us and you want to stay on and grow your business and roll some equity and and and you're still excited.

00:17:26.720 --> 00:17:28.640
That's that's the majority of the deals we do.

00:17:28.799 --> 00:17:41.759
Number number two is is you'd like to retire, you'd like to retire the next one to two years, and you know, and you know, I I had I had a um I had a great great lady that we partnered with, and she said, Jacob, I'm 65.

00:17:41.839 --> 00:17:44.880
I don't know if I'm gonna be around when my equity rolls.

00:17:46.559 --> 00:17:48.160
I was like, oh, I hear you.

00:17:48.240 --> 00:17:49.119
That's that that's great.

00:17:49.279 --> 00:17:54.400
And and so, so so she's she's retiring kind of at the end of this year, and we have a plan in place for that.

00:17:54.559 --> 00:18:18.400
And then the third one is um is there's a lot of very small vacation rental businesses that have maybe come out of like real estate businesses or they got into it by accident and and and they haven't really built a team, and maybe maybe they manage like 30 or 40 properties and they're just in this funk zone where they're answering every guest, every owner phone call, they're doing revenue, they're doing accounting, they're doing it all, and they would just like to get out.

00:18:18.480 --> 00:18:22.559
And and and we also, you know, play there as well in a meaningful way.

00:18:22.640 --> 00:18:24.160
So no, that's that that's great.

00:18:24.240 --> 00:18:25.599
And and that makes a lot of sense.

00:18:25.680 --> 00:18:36.960
And I think that's good to have, you know, flexibility for what an exit looks like, you know, because I'm sure you know everybody at that point are thinking about that as like, you know, what is the best, what is the best way to do this?

00:18:37.119 --> 00:18:37.920
Do I want to stay in?

00:18:38.079 --> 00:18:39.039
Do I want to franchise?

00:18:39.200 --> 00:18:39.839
Do I want to sell?

00:18:40.000 --> 00:18:41.519
Do I want to be out tomorrow?

00:18:41.680 --> 00:18:43.200
Do I still want to have a hand in it?

00:18:43.279 --> 00:18:51.200
And I think probably, you know, most of the companies, if they've been doing this for a long time, they they're scared to move into that next phase of life, right?

00:18:51.359 --> 00:18:57.039
Because it's like you're you're losing your identity, but you also want to make sure you protect what you've built and your people.

00:18:57.200 --> 00:18:59.519
I think that's the thing we hear the most often.

00:18:59.839 --> 00:19:03.839
I think um, yeah, just to touch on that is I'm not human, right?

00:19:04.000 --> 00:19:08.880
So, like, like like we we built a we built a vacation road business and we transacted it, right?

00:19:08.960 --> 00:19:14.079
And we're still in, and that it was for the better for everybody involved, whether you're an employee.

00:19:14.160 --> 00:19:23.440
And so so so as we have these conversations, I I think I boil this down to someone, you know, looking at the next step probably is probably wants three things.

00:19:23.680 --> 00:19:26.480
One, they want their owners to be taken care of.

00:19:26.559 --> 00:19:30.160
Like, you know, a lot of a lot of times they have these personal relationships with property owners.

00:19:30.319 --> 00:19:33.119
I I still take property owner calls today.

00:19:33.279 --> 00:19:37.599
Um, you know, hey Jacob, do you mind going by and checking um checking the the the pool?

00:19:38.160 --> 00:19:41.920
Yeah, little do they know that they're that's right.

00:19:42.480 --> 00:19:45.920
I I don't do that much anymore, but it but still take their phone calls.

00:19:46.079 --> 00:19:48.640
Um number two, they want their employees to be taken care of, right?

00:19:48.720 --> 00:19:55.039
A lot of these sometimes these people are family, sometimes they're cousins, distant relatives, friends, people that have been in the business for 20 plus years.

00:19:55.200 --> 00:19:59.519
And at the end of the day, they want to make sure their jobs are secure, they're taken care of.

00:19:59.680 --> 00:20:05.200
Um they're better off from a benefit standpoint, from a compensation and maybe future career goals and objectives.

00:20:05.359 --> 00:20:16.720
Um, and then the third thing is they'd like to basically stick an ATM card into their br into their sweat equity and a little bit aside for their family in a rainy day or all of it or whatever that might be.

00:20:16.799 --> 00:20:21.359
And and um, and as we have those conversations, that's what that's that's a way day sweet spot.

00:20:21.440 --> 00:20:25.119
We cover every single one of those corners very, very well.

00:20:25.359 --> 00:20:28.880
We'll be back in just a minute, but first, a word from our premier brand sponsor.

00:20:29.200 --> 00:20:30.400
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00:20:30.559 --> 00:20:32.880
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00:20:33.279 --> 00:20:36.880
We have been working with my BookingPal since about 2019.

00:20:37.200 --> 00:20:40.799
Hoseiva is a full service property manager and software company.

00:20:40.960 --> 00:20:46.160
We manage about 6,000 properties over 16 countries over a myriad of services.

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At Hoseva, we have our own custom-built PMS where we build our own direct channel connections.

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The reason we decided to partner with BookingPal is because they were able to expand our reach.

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BookingPal really stays on top of making sure that all partners have easy API access to add on the channels, even for people like us who have our own channel connections.

00:21:06.880 --> 00:21:14.559
Implementing the integrations with my BookingPal have allowed our teams, you know, more time and more trust and less worry on our side, right?

00:21:14.640 --> 00:21:16.000
We know things are working.

00:21:16.240 --> 00:21:25.359
The reason Booking Pow was a good strategic choice for our business was we specifically wanted to connect to some of the channels that they had access to that nobody else did.

00:21:25.599 --> 00:21:30.880
Having the exclusive ability to distribute to homes and hideaways by Hyde has been a big plus for us.

00:21:31.119 --> 00:21:49.119
We are impressively growing in the independent hotel and multifamily sector where being able to attract those travelers that are used to staying in a hotel like a high and feeling safe with that kind of brand has been really increasing when it comes to um conversion and numbers for our revenue side for these type of properties.

00:21:49.359 --> 00:21:53.440
I would say Booking Palace a partner is a really good loyal friendship, right?

00:21:53.519 --> 00:21:58.319
You know, we have a nice integration that's obviously put deep rooted in the tech, right?

00:21:58.400 --> 00:21:59.759
But the teams really speak well together.

00:22:00.319 --> 00:22:02.880
And we have a direct contact if we need it.

00:22:03.039 --> 00:22:08.079
It really is important to us to have 24-7 customer support, and we really value that in our partners.

00:22:08.319 --> 00:22:10.880
I would definitely recommend MindBookingPels to others.

00:22:11.039 --> 00:22:17.599
It has just helped us to continue to grow and be in front of as many travelers as possible.

00:22:17.759 --> 00:22:22.640
And it's helped us to do that with ease and with partners that we feel like we can trust.

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00:22:48.480 --> 00:23:13.920
One thing that we're talking a lot about this year in particular with the initiative that we're building, which is called the Growth Blueprint, and how we're aligning different um suppliers and property managers within the industry to talk on this concept that there's been a lot of companies since COVID that it's been like growth at all costs, that you know, that it just it's about inventory and units and how many doors you have and however you're gonna get there, it doesn't really matter.

00:23:14.079 --> 00:23:20.000
But you know, the goal is you want to be able to sell because I think people saw, okay, these companies that are getting bought, they're making good money.

00:23:20.079 --> 00:23:24.079
So if I build up a portfolio, you know, in a few years, I'll be able to sell this.

00:23:24.160 --> 00:23:36.079
And you know, in some cases that happens and they've done a good job, but a lot of companies that we see are it really is growth at all costs, and like they they're not building a culture around their team and they're not investing in their people and their brands.

00:23:36.319 --> 00:23:54.559
And you know, that is not as valuable of an asset when you get to the point of you know, talking to you guys or some of the other ones out there that that's probably not an attractive company for you to buy if you're just buying the inventory and you don't have people that uh will stay because they're they're not loyal to who they were with before and they don't know you guys.

00:23:54.640 --> 00:23:57.039
I mean, that that's probably something you avoid, I would imagine.

00:23:57.279 --> 00:23:57.680
Yeah, yeah.

00:23:57.759 --> 00:24:10.640
I mean, my my my advice to anyone is like, and this has been always my philosophy here is um is build a great business, put a bunch of points on the board, and you will have as many outcomes as you like, you know.

00:24:10.880 --> 00:24:15.920
Um and uh and and and those outcomes can be pretty wide.

00:24:16.000 --> 00:24:24.240
And so I I think you know, away day is a operation, a vacation rental operator business that does MA.

00:24:24.400 --> 00:24:27.680
It is not an MA business that does operations.

00:24:27.839 --> 00:24:30.799
And I think Yeah, you're operations first and then MA.

00:24:30.960 --> 00:24:31.039
Yeah.

00:24:31.519 --> 00:24:35.359
And um, and I think that kind of gets lost in the mix a little bit too often.

00:24:35.680 --> 00:24:46.960
I do agree, like, you know, part part of me uh when when we go to Vermas, I'm I I'm thinking, man, I think all these people should focus a lot more on building a great business than selling their business.

00:24:47.119 --> 00:24:55.440
And I and I I I would like to see, and I think that's better for our industry just generally, is for is for the quality of the business to get better.

00:24:55.519 --> 00:24:57.759
And inventory selection is really important to us.

00:24:57.839 --> 00:25:00.480
We we add a lot of properties to to away day.

00:25:00.640 --> 00:25:07.920
Um this past year we added 3,000 new properties to our program organically, not not through, not through MA activity.

00:25:08.400 --> 00:25:15.759
Um that's that that that's basic that that was roughly like 17, 18-ish organic, you know, new unit count growth.

00:25:16.240 --> 00:25:20.000
Um we have a pretty every single one of our businesses has a brand standard.

00:25:20.160 --> 00:25:22.799
So this is the standard that the property must live up to.

00:25:22.960 --> 00:25:28.400
Um, you have luxury in your name, you're not bringing in a not luxurious property onto your program, right?

00:25:28.880 --> 00:25:29.359
Right, yeah.

00:25:29.599 --> 00:25:42.640
Uh and then and then there is multiple sign-offs on that property, whether it is a revenue projection sign-off, whether it is a quality of the property sign-off, not just from the business development person, but also from the leader who's managing it.

00:25:42.720 --> 00:25:59.359
We all have to be tied arm to arm that this is the right property for our program, because otherwise you'll blink and you will accidentally have the wrong properties on your program, and revenue management will become more of a challenge, and then those properties will inevitably churn.

00:25:59.519 --> 00:26:13.279
And then the properties that are the good properties, you end up spending all of your time and attention trying to find and book revenue and marketing strategies for your poor performing inventory that you lose sight of your good inventory, and then those people start to churn.

00:26:13.440 --> 00:26:16.880
And so it's a venture cycle.

00:26:16.960 --> 00:26:22.160
It's so inventory selection is very critical in this business.

00:26:22.480 --> 00:26:24.720
So I was curious, what does it look like?

00:26:24.880 --> 00:26:31.680
I think this is where um these larger portfolios, you know, people get lost in in what's important.

00:26:31.759 --> 00:26:36.160
And I think it's good that you're talking about like the operations and and the vetting of inventory.

00:26:36.319 --> 00:26:43.200
But take us through what it looks like when you acquire a business and kind of the onboarding, because I think there's several schools of thought.

00:26:43.279 --> 00:26:48.799
There's a, you know, all we're gonna do is come in and assess your technology and help you do the technology.

00:26:48.960 --> 00:26:55.039
Or there is a we're gonna help you just assess the operations and help you do economies of scale in terms of buying things.

00:26:55.119 --> 00:27:04.480
Um, and then there's some that just want to come in and completely gut out the operation and say the brand standard is at the away, you know, in your case, away day level and we filter it down.

00:27:04.559 --> 00:27:05.359
So what does it look like?

00:27:05.440 --> 00:27:15.839
Because it sounds like you've got sort of a hybrid approach to this that you assess based on the market conditions and the manager that you pick up, but kind of maybe walk us through a timeline.

00:27:16.160 --> 00:27:29.039
And and I'll I'll preface this in saying, like, as you can imagine, like we have homes in the Hamptons, and then we have homes in Panama City, and we have homes in in Park City, and we have properties in Sedona, and you know, and they all can't be treated the same.

00:27:29.200 --> 00:27:36.079
I I I if we tried to put the quality of linen that goes into a Hamptons property in Panama City, we we wouldn't be able to pay the bills.

00:27:36.240 --> 00:27:47.759
And if we tried to put you know, the quality of pro uh linen in a Panama City property, and this isn't hitting my Panama City team, it's just smaller one, two, three bedroom condos in a Hamptons home.

00:27:47.839 --> 00:27:53.119
The expectations are just different and the guest profile is different, and and we would underservice the Hamptons.

00:27:53.359 --> 00:27:57.759
So you can't have you got to be very prescriptive locally on what's best.

00:27:58.400 --> 00:27:59.599
And you also have to ask the question.

00:27:59.680 --> 00:28:03.279
I mean, the number one question I ask when I go into a market is like, hey, what would you do if you were me?

00:28:03.359 --> 00:28:05.599
You know, hey, this is your this is your business.

00:28:05.680 --> 00:28:08.559
What what what's what's the one thing I should go do?

00:28:08.799 --> 00:28:11.839
And you're you'd be amazed at the answers that you get from these people.

00:28:11.920 --> 00:28:14.880
They know what needs to be done and they know what we need to improve on.

00:28:15.039 --> 00:28:16.400
And so it's just talking to them.

00:28:16.720 --> 00:28:22.319
So back to like the original question is like, so what is we we call it value creation, what's our value creation plan?

00:28:22.400 --> 00:28:25.519
And and I I think this is the away day superpower is.

00:28:25.599 --> 00:28:33.759
And once we go back to how does a business get bigger and better with with our support, it's because we've got really dedicated resources to value creation.

00:28:33.920 --> 00:28:35.599
It falls into three buckets.

00:28:35.759 --> 00:28:37.839
One, let's let's grow, right?

00:28:38.000 --> 00:28:45.680
Let's grow quality unit count, let's grow revenue management in TrevPar, let's in RevPar, the owners got to do better there.

00:28:45.759 --> 00:28:47.759
Let's let's let's put some marketing in place.

00:28:47.920 --> 00:28:49.920
Let's let's grow the business.

00:28:50.079 --> 00:28:56.720
Um, we have to the minute we start growing, you're not really gonna see the rewards of that for a year, 18 days, right?

00:28:56.799 --> 00:29:05.039
It takes a long time for a property to go from brand new in the system to to to really producing full results on a full-year basis.

00:29:05.119 --> 00:29:06.240
That that that's a cycle.

00:29:06.799 --> 00:29:10.799
Number number two is let's improve the operations of the business.

00:29:10.960 --> 00:29:21.039
So one of my favorite things, and this gets back to just my CPA and finance background, um, is we we have 55 different PLs across the business, right?

00:29:21.440 --> 00:29:28.880
We can see labor margins, we can see cleaning margins, we can see OTA mix, um, we can see facility costs.

00:29:29.119 --> 00:29:33.440
We have a lot of ideas about how people can improve their local operations.

00:29:33.680 --> 00:29:36.559
And we're gonna come to you with those ideas and those thoughts.

00:29:36.720 --> 00:29:39.759
That doesn't mean that you should take them and implement them right away.

00:29:40.079 --> 00:29:46.079
And usually the way the conversation would go is like, all right, Annie, here's some thoughts that we have about your business.

00:29:46.319 --> 00:29:47.599
You're the expert.

00:29:48.079 --> 00:29:52.000
Can we work through this together and figure out what we should do and what we should do?

00:29:52.240 --> 00:29:55.839
At the end of the day, most of the things on that list get done and implemented.

00:29:56.000 --> 00:29:56.799
So that's number two.

00:29:57.119 --> 00:29:59.039
Number three is shared scale.

00:29:59.200 --> 00:30:18.559
And so there is just a purchasing power that we have by having, I think it's 15,000 properties, could be 16,000 properties under management at this point, that that that is hard to compete with, whether that's software products, whether that's soaps and shampoos, whether that is linen ordering.

00:30:18.880 --> 00:30:27.279
And so usually the procurement savings alone is anywhere between 10 to 20% reduction in the cost of the business.

00:30:27.359 --> 00:30:35.440
Um and then and then the uh and then the operational improvement is anywhere between five and 15% improvement.

00:30:35.519 --> 00:30:40.160
And then after that comes the wave of growth when we started to add, you know, new and the right properties.

00:30:40.240 --> 00:30:44.400
And so as you think about like, so how does a way they grow the average business by 56%?

00:30:44.720 --> 00:30:46.880
It's a combination of those three things.

00:30:47.039 --> 00:30:50.079
Um, and sometimes there's more of one and less of the other.

00:30:50.240 --> 00:30:53.200
Um, and but but that's but that's what we're focused on.

00:30:53.519 --> 00:30:57.599
And what does that actually look like as far as the centralized services?

00:30:57.759 --> 00:31:06.559
So like revenue management, marketing, like what things are you taking accounting, like what things are you taking off their plate, if any, or like where are you most involved?

00:31:06.880 --> 00:31:12.559
Yeah, so um I I the two areas that that that need involvement, right?

00:31:12.640 --> 00:31:21.920
And some of that is just for some Uncle Sam reasons, but but and and for some financial reasons, is um in order for us to be able to is HR and accounting, right?

00:31:22.000 --> 00:31:34.960
HR and accounting, talent management system, from being able to have a clear picture of pay bans and comp structures and and and making sure we've got equitable compensation packages around the business, like we got to get it all into one system.

00:31:35.039 --> 00:31:39.680
And so um we do have a very generic uh HR system.

00:31:39.839 --> 00:31:46.079
Um we actually call it VRHR, which uh don't fall out of your chair on that one.

00:31:46.319 --> 00:31:57.039
Um but but but that that's important because we don't want anybody to feel like they're an away day employee if they're l living in in Myrtle Beach or Panama City.

00:31:57.200 --> 00:31:58.319
You belong to the local shop.

00:31:58.559 --> 00:31:59.279
You don't report to me.

00:31:59.359 --> 00:32:03.599
If I so if I so happen to walk in the business and you ask me what to do, I'm like, I'm not your boss.

00:32:03.680 --> 00:32:11.519
Like, you know, you're like you guys live here and work here and operate here, and your paycheck is not an away day paycheck, it is a local brand paycheck.

00:32:11.680 --> 00:32:13.359
Um, and so so we think that's really critical.

00:32:13.440 --> 00:32:14.720
The second one's accounting, right?

00:32:14.799 --> 00:32:21.920
Because we can't have, you know, 50 plus different chart of accounts because it'll just be make sense out of everything.

00:32:22.319 --> 00:32:22.960
Crazy.

00:32:23.279 --> 00:32:28.160
So so what we did with our our our CFO David Reed a few years ago, he's fantastic.

00:32:28.319 --> 00:32:36.400
We put together a chart of accounts that everybody could nod and agree upon that this is the right chart of accounts no matter where your business is at.

00:32:36.559 --> 00:32:38.559
And um, and we thought that was a very critical thing.

00:32:38.640 --> 00:32:42.000
And it's been pretty unleashing for the organization to be able to get the analysis out.

00:32:42.160 --> 00:32:45.839
So those are the two must-dos, and and we do we do those right away.

00:32:46.000 --> 00:32:52.319
I would say like the the next big value creator is our business development and organic engine.

00:32:52.480 --> 00:32:56.319
Um, and it and um this is this was birthed out of RealJoy.

00:32:56.480 --> 00:33:02.799
Real Joy just has always done a good job of adding the right and new units to the program and winning them over.

00:33:02.880 --> 00:33:05.519
And so we've deployed that strategy and it's only got better.

00:33:05.599 --> 00:33:15.839
We we we brought on a gentleman named Dan Yankley, and Dan's been a phenomenal ad to Ryan and Ryan's team, and and they've been you know just just really driving organic growth across the system.

00:33:16.000 --> 00:33:20.880
So that's like a close follow um because that's an engine to help help help build value.

00:33:21.039 --> 00:33:25.920
And then the the the next one after that that is a close follow is revenue management support.

00:33:26.079 --> 00:33:30.160
We know that, and both this falls under both business development and revenue management.

00:33:30.319 --> 00:33:49.680
You know, I'm in this market, so so I can I can say some of these things, but like, you know, the the Pensacola Beach Blue Angel show or the Sandestin Food and Wine Festival or Boat Week or Bike Week or whatever happens locally, we can't help and influence those things from a centralized system, right?

00:33:49.759 --> 00:33:55.279
Like we have to have local ownership over revenue management and business development.

00:33:55.440 --> 00:33:58.799
We we can't look at a map and say this is a good location for a property.

00:33:58.960 --> 00:34:08.079
The local team has to say, hey, that building's not great because the HOA is just as hard to deal with and we can't it's really difficult to get guests checked in, right?

00:34:08.159 --> 00:34:10.480
Um, those all have to happen locally.

00:34:10.559 --> 00:34:17.199
And I think once you pull that local ownership and autonomy out of it, it really hurts the overall business.

00:34:17.440 --> 00:34:26.480
I think that's another big part of a way day, is you know, one of our we didn't really go over our core values, but our core values are servant leadership, ownership mentality, local, and excellence.

00:34:26.800 --> 00:34:37.199
And if you if you put the ball in the local team's hands from a business development and a revenue management and operation, like they get excited, they win, they win new units.

00:34:37.360 --> 00:34:40.719
That's um they win the revenue game, they're beating the local market.

00:34:40.880 --> 00:34:44.079
All of those things, you know, help to spin the flywheel.

00:34:44.239 --> 00:34:50.079
And so we try to drive as much local ownership and centralized support as possible.

00:34:50.320 --> 00:34:55.440
Um, and like I said earlier, like, you know, the away day supporting team doesn't sit on top of the business.

00:34:55.519 --> 00:35:01.599
They we we we sit below the business, and our job is to serve them and for them to not not to serve us.

00:35:02.000 --> 00:35:03.760
Great mentality to of support.

00:35:03.840 --> 00:35:11.199
So they know that they've got this this this foundation that they can stand on in what they do for sure.

00:35:11.440 --> 00:35:15.840
And uh Anthony Batero, that's your uh head of revenue.

00:35:16.000 --> 00:35:17.920
Annie and I have known him for a long time.

00:35:18.000 --> 00:35:26.800
So Anthony on this call, he would be way way more entertaining than we should have him on the show.

00:35:26.880 --> 00:35:28.719
He'd be he'd be a he'd be a fun guest to have a show.

00:35:29.679 --> 00:35:30.320
Listen to this.

00:35:30.400 --> 00:35:34.880
We need we need to we need to make sure we edit edit the the the podcast before it goes live.

00:35:37.199 --> 00:35:39.760
We're signing him up for something he did not ask for.

00:35:39.840 --> 00:35:42.719
Yeah, we'll just send him a calendar invite and tell him he has to do it.

00:35:42.960 --> 00:35:43.440
Yeah.

00:35:43.679 --> 00:35:44.639
No, I'm curious.

00:35:44.800 --> 00:35:51.440
I mean, uh AI, of course, everybody's is trying to figure out in diff in different ways, you know, how they're implementing this into the business.

00:35:51.599 --> 00:36:07.039
And for groups like Wayday, we've talked to you know, many of them that they are either building like an AI, a layer or something on top of the different PMSs and systems that they use so that they do have that visibility into what's going on in each market.

00:36:07.280 --> 00:36:09.119
Is that something that you guys have done?

00:36:09.599 --> 00:36:10.079
For sure.

00:36:10.239 --> 00:36:23.119
And and I and you know, Tom, uh who's our head of AI or head of technology is is is far more uh more capable person of having the conversation with these with you you all than I am, but I'll give you kind of the high-level approach.

00:36:23.280 --> 00:36:38.480
Um and and I can't I shared shared this with you earlier, but I was on a meeting with a local, you know, uh entrepreneur that is really spending most of their time tweaking AI into their business and and doing some really, really great things.

00:36:38.639 --> 00:36:45.840
And um, you know, he he said uh he said, I I enjoy working with legacy founders like you.

00:36:46.000 --> 00:36:52.239
And I was like, legacy, oh man, I'm really getting old in this industry.

00:36:52.400 --> 00:36:57.760
I've always been been the young one and not necessarily this all shifted very fast.

00:36:57.920 --> 00:36:59.039
And I and I think he's right.

00:36:59.199 --> 00:37:05.360
I think that AI is is gonna be really capable of improving guest and owner experiences.

00:37:05.440 --> 00:37:13.599
I I think that my my my view is that technology improvements always find their way down into the customer's savings, right?

00:37:13.760 --> 00:37:21.119
Um, meaning, like, I think the wrong approach is to think through how we could reduce our cost through AI.

00:37:21.360 --> 00:37:36.400
I think the right approach is how do we marry up the needs of a guest and the needs of an owner with how AI can provide those things faster, quicker, more accurate, um, and and and and in a well in a better informed way.

00:37:36.719 --> 00:37:38.559
And I and we're more focused on that.

00:37:38.719 --> 00:37:46.960
So, so like this is for me, AI, you know, we we've never jumped on the bandwagon of like offshore support, right?

00:37:47.039 --> 00:37:48.880
We don't have any offshore call centers.

00:37:49.039 --> 00:37:51.599
We we we don't we don't do any of that type of thing.

00:37:51.760 --> 00:37:55.119
And it's always because I want to make sure we're providing the best support.

00:37:55.280 --> 00:38:05.039
And I think that while offshore workers might be great, somebody that understands the best coffee shop in the town is far better and more capable of interacting with the guest.

00:38:05.119 --> 00:38:06.480
And I think that's the right view.

00:38:06.639 --> 00:38:12.320
Now, if AI can help do that or help that person do that fast, then then we're gonna support that.

00:38:12.400 --> 00:38:17.440
And so, you know, we spent a lot of time building layers and data lakes and data oceans and pools.

00:38:17.519 --> 00:38:20.559
And like I said, Tom could do that, talk about this much better than I am.

00:38:20.719 --> 00:38:25.280
But but what what what we've built is um is what what Tom refers to as our semantic layer.

00:38:25.360 --> 00:38:36.559
And it's the layer that sits over the data that makes sure it's easily accessible, um, it's queryable, it's uh it's factual, it provides the right information, not just a answer.

00:38:36.800 --> 00:38:39.519
And um, and and that that's all coming together really nice.

00:38:39.599 --> 00:38:49.440
And what we're doing now is we're beta testing the results of this in a few shops across the country, um, a few of the businesses, um, and really tweaking and creating workflows.

00:38:49.679 --> 00:38:57.360
But you know, we we we have people just fully dedicated to AI, and we're hiring more people fully dedicated to AI right now.

00:38:57.599 --> 00:39:01.360
And just like everybody, we're we're trying to figure, we're just trying to figure this out.

00:39:01.440 --> 00:39:03.920
And I think that's I think that's what everybody's doing.

00:39:04.000 --> 00:39:14.159
If someone jumps on a call and says, hey, this is what it's gonna happen, this is when it's gonna happen and where it's gonna happen, I wouldn't believe them for a second because it's evolving so so quick.

00:39:14.400 --> 00:39:15.840
So yeah.

00:39:16.239 --> 00:39:16.480
Yeah.

00:39:16.639 --> 00:39:30.159
So we we've been talking a lot about um, seems like every week we'll, you know, log in from the weekend and you get a in your inbox is full of the newest, latest thing that you need to be doing from the latest expert that wasn't even in the business, you know, last week.

00:39:30.639 --> 00:39:31.920
It's just pop out of nowhere.

00:39:32.000 --> 00:39:35.920
So it is one of those things that it's like there's no certainties, except it's uncertain at this point.

00:39:36.000 --> 00:39:37.360
It's just gonna continue to change.

00:39:38.079 --> 00:39:47.840
My my favorite people to talk to right now, and I I try to have these conversations as often, you know, two or three a week, is not necessarily the the expert, like the AI expert.

00:39:48.000 --> 00:39:51.119
I want to talk to the person who they eat, sleep, breathe it.

00:39:51.199 --> 00:39:52.079
That's all that they do.

00:39:52.159 --> 00:39:54.320
They're like working on it constantly.

00:39:54.559 --> 00:40:02.400
It's the you know, young 20, he or she that is just fiddling in their business constantly on AI, and it's all that they can think about.

00:40:02.559 --> 00:40:11.519
Those are the really interesting people to me because they have real, real experience here, not just, you know, not just theory.

00:40:11.599 --> 00:40:14.079
It's actually like talking about it, yeah.

00:40:14.239 --> 00:40:16.639
Actually, application of it, yeah, and benefits.

00:40:16.960 --> 00:40:19.519
So those yeah, those conversations are really interesting.

00:40:19.760 --> 00:40:20.320
Yeah, I bet.

00:40:20.480 --> 00:40:25.199
And and it was interesting you say that because I was talking to, I'm not sure if you know a gentleman out in um Arizona.

00:40:25.360 --> 00:40:26.639
His name is John Hildebrand.

00:40:26.880 --> 00:40:33.440
He's got some properties, I think he's in Flagstaff, but he was somebody that was like just a small host, and he's not a bit, he's not big by any means.

00:40:33.599 --> 00:40:41.039
I think he probably has like maybe 20 properties, but got very active and and just really sharing kind of his experiences and those types of things.

00:40:41.119 --> 00:40:48.559
And he had commented on a post last week or made a post last week about he had built on an operational tool from his AI.

00:40:48.719 --> 00:40:51.360
And he was like, he was like, and this is what it does, and he was explaining it.

00:40:51.440 --> 00:40:59.119
And so my question was like, what do you think that means for property management systems that have bolt-ons for these type of things?

00:40:59.360 --> 00:41:04.159
Like, you know, one, is that going to mean the bolt-on doesn't exist anymore because somebody can do it?

00:41:04.320 --> 00:41:15.199
Or, and two, does it mean like the the the manager could doesn't they don't they no longer have to use all the tools within the PMS because they can go and they can build their own things?

00:41:15.280 --> 00:41:16.400
And you're seeing what people do.

00:41:16.480 --> 00:41:24.239
I've seen um JJ King's built some stuff like his own reportings and apps and you know, all kinds of things with what these these different tools can do.

00:41:24.320 --> 00:41:30.480
And so I think it's what to your point is like people are being really creative with it and finding the ways that it best suits their business.

00:41:30.559 --> 00:41:35.920
So it kind of means to me is like there's not gonna be this one size fits all system out there anymore.

00:41:36.000 --> 00:41:43.280
And like Alex works for Boom, and we talked to somebody from another system that's coming out shortly, um, that's an AI native PMS.

00:41:43.360 --> 00:41:46.880
It's like you're gonna be able to customize so much of what you do day to day.

00:41:46.960 --> 00:41:54.320
And I think for away day, that's where it comes in that you are gonna be able to like customize based on your operations within each market.

00:41:54.719 --> 00:41:58.960
Yeah, and and it might be able to make those suggestions on its own based upon customer sentiment.

00:41:59.199 --> 00:42:00.480
Right, once it learns, yeah.

00:42:01.039 --> 00:42:04.719
And so I I think I think I think there's core tenants that will always be there, right?

00:42:04.800 --> 00:42:06.159
Like, so what does a guest want?

00:42:06.320 --> 00:42:15.760
They want a clean and well-maintained maintained property that looks like it looked in the pictures with really uh solid arrival instructions, right?

00:42:15.840 --> 00:42:21.360
And if they need anything, they want a fast reaction um and and like one touch solutions.

00:42:21.519 --> 00:42:23.360
They don't want to call you twice or talk to you twice.

00:42:23.519 --> 00:42:25.760
They just like I asked for this, you gave me, right?

00:42:26.079 --> 00:42:30.559
That's going to exist in you know, through time.

00:42:30.719 --> 00:42:32.800
Like like those needs are not gonna change.

00:42:32.960 --> 00:42:42.159
And so, so so our focus is making sure that we are working back from the timeless customer needs and using AI to solve those things faster.

00:42:42.400 --> 00:42:44.639
And uh, and I and that's our approach today.

00:42:44.719 --> 00:42:46.639
I I don't think that will will probably shift.

00:42:46.800 --> 00:42:49.760
And you could say the same thing about owner, you know, what what does the owner want?

00:42:49.920 --> 00:42:54.000
They want they they want to earn the amount of the on for their property that you said that they would.

00:42:54.079 --> 00:43:02.480
They want a clean and well-maintained property, and they don't want to come into town and spend the entire time they're on vacation doing property management that they're paying you to do.

00:43:02.639 --> 00:43:06.320
And then they want you to be proactive communicators on like what's going on with their home.

00:43:06.480 --> 00:43:14.159
And, you know, I think I can help those things or at least help a human to get smarter on on knowing those things faster.

00:43:14.320 --> 00:43:17.119
And so um, I I I'm excited about it.

00:43:17.199 --> 00:43:24.480
And you know, I our technology leader is probably one of the top two or three people in my email inbox, and I had to apologize on to today.

00:43:24.639 --> 00:43:34.719
It's like, hey, and I really apologize, just say, hey, like you will continue to receive these many questions and these many asks and you know from us, and this is just the phase of the business that we're in.

00:43:34.800 --> 00:43:39.199
And so it's it's an exciting, I think it's an really exciting time to be in our industry.

00:43:39.280 --> 00:43:42.800
Um, and then generally just uh working with tools like this.

00:43:43.119 --> 00:43:43.840
Yeah, for sure.

00:43:44.000 --> 00:43:45.199
We'll be back in just a minute.

00:43:45.360 --> 00:43:47.679
But first, a word from our premier brand sponsor.

00:43:48.079 --> 00:43:56.719
My name's Chad, and I am the founder of Eco Escapes, a vacation rental management business based out of Canada, and I've been using Hostfly for just about a year now.

00:43:57.039 --> 00:44:04.719
Before we were using Hostflea as our PMS, a lot Of the integrations could take a lot of time, or you need to really know what you're doing.

00:44:04.800 --> 00:44:13.199
And that's where Host Fleet came in, and they were able to help guide us along a lot of the integrations with the different channels with their exceptional customer service.

00:44:13.360 --> 00:44:16.719
Even like with their old PMS, they were familiar with it and how it worked.

00:44:16.880 --> 00:44:24.079
So it made the process of switching really easy with extracting a lot of the information they needed and transferring it over to Host Fleet.

00:44:24.239 --> 00:44:27.119
It just made the whole process super smooth and seamless.

00:44:27.440 --> 00:44:35.440
The best way that it's improved our guest experience and positive reviews is the level of consistency it has with all of the different channels.

00:44:35.679 --> 00:44:54.400
A lot of the work that we've put into setting up the perfect sequence of automated messages and the templates and triggers with the emails and also their SMS functionality, which our old VMS didn't have, just helped a ton with getting a lot more five-star reviews across different platforms.

00:44:54.639 --> 00:45:02.400
One thing that really stood out to me is how much they are improving and willing to invest in future integrations, strengthening like their APIs.

00:45:02.480 --> 00:45:08.320
And they're also a preferred partner with Airbnb, and they just got the platinum status with VRBO.

00:45:08.480 --> 00:45:15.440
So to have that level of authority with those major OTAs also had a big factor in my decision.

00:45:15.679 --> 00:45:21.599
A lot of the issues that we encountered in our last property management software were alleviated completely.

00:45:21.760 --> 00:45:27.599
And any small issues that have came up, they were so quick to respond and help fix it.

00:45:27.760 --> 00:45:35.840
Working with the Host Flea team has been fantastic, not only because of how great the actual software is, but just the people that I've met.

00:45:36.000 --> 00:45:40.000
They're the kinds of people that I would be happy to go for lunch with or grab a beer with.

00:45:48.800 --> 00:45:58.559
Yeah, if someone else was on the fence about switching to hostfully, I would tell them it'll probably be the best thing you do, and your business and revenue will increase tremendously from making that switch.

00:45:58.880 --> 00:46:02.719
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Click the link in the description to get started today.

00:46:16.239 --> 00:46:35.840
We did a uh April Fool's joke today on LinkedIn for Boom that after a lot of internal discussion, we're decided to go away from AI that you know everybody wants to go back to manual systems, checking 10 different dashboards and uh catching issues only once they've been escalated and how it just you know keeps the team sharp.

00:46:37.519 --> 00:46:45.119
Um, but you know, it's funny because it's like on one hand, when you look at a vacation rental business, I mean, it there's never a dull moment, right?

00:46:45.199 --> 00:46:46.480
Like there's always something going on.

00:46:46.559 --> 00:46:48.800
There's there's always some issue to solve.

00:46:49.119 --> 00:46:54.000
But all the issues are it's every once in a while you get something that's like really out of left field.

00:46:54.079 --> 00:46:58.079
But for the most part, it is it's the same type of questions, it's the same type of issues.

00:46:58.159 --> 00:47:16.559
And I think the companies that you know we see that are are really well run, like the ones that that you were part of, and these that are now part of a way day, is you recognize those patterns and whether you're you're using AI or not, I mean, you start to build your plan for when those things happen so that it doesn't feel like every day your hair is on fire.

00:47:16.800 --> 00:47:27.679
But I I'm curious, kind of on that note, on the operations side, before AI and all that, I mean, it sounds like at RealJo, you guys probably developed a lot of SOPs for everything in the business.00:47:27.840 --> 00:47:30.239


Um, any reflections on that you could share?00:47:30.320 --> 00:47:31.280


I think that would be interesting for our.00:47:31.760 --> 00:47:32.000


Yeah.00:47:32.079 --> 00:47:37.199


I mean, I I think um, you know, so and it gets back to to maybe like one of the things.00:47:37.360 --> 00:47:42.239


So why why is this a difficult industry and a difficult business like, you know, and and it just is.00:47:42.320 --> 00:47:46.559


And and um, and I'm not ashamed to say like this is this is hard, right?00:47:46.639 --> 00:47:54.000


It's it's um any vacation rental manager you talk to that's trying to scale their business or even just maintain it will should admit that like this isn't easy.00:47:54.079 --> 00:47:56.400


It's it's a task and it's it's hard to do.00:47:56.559 --> 00:47:57.440


And why is that?00:47:57.599 --> 00:48:01.679


And the main reason is that the founders, like it's a dual-sided marketplace.00:48:01.760 --> 00:48:16.719


You got owners and guests, and these founders of these businesses have a lot of tribal and institutional knowledge about the owner experience, the owner's kids' names, where they live, you know, what what the specific things happen around their their their house.00:48:16.880 --> 00:48:30.960


Um, they've got a lot of institutional tribal knowledge about how to deal with guests and take care of escalated issues, and and it's very difficult to get all of that transferred over to another human, even SOPs in training.00:48:31.039 --> 00:48:36.000


So I'd say yes, uh, real joy has if you there's an SOP for everything for sure.00:48:36.320 --> 00:48:45.280


But but we but we what we shifted to um as we started to scale is really making sure we spent time on the why, right?00:48:45.599 --> 00:48:49.599


Um and uh and and and I think that's a better way to do it.00:48:49.679 --> 00:48:51.360


And so how how do you do those things?00:48:51.599 --> 00:48:53.840


I think mission and values are critical.00:48:54.000 --> 00:49:02.960


Um I think you're talking about your mission, our mission at away day is to perfect the vacation experience, core values of servant leadership, ownership, mentality, local, and excellence.00:49:03.199 --> 00:49:07.119


Every single meeting that we start at away day starts with that.00:49:07.440 --> 00:49:10.719


And then we get around the horn and we say, like, what does that mean to you?00:49:10.880 --> 00:49:14.559


And who's someone that's that's in you know embodying that today?00:49:14.719 --> 00:49:16.559


Um, we did that, that comes out of Real Joy.00:49:16.639 --> 00:49:17.760


That's what we did at Real Joy.00:49:18.000 --> 00:49:21.119


And so, you know, the morning stand-ups were mission and values.00:49:21.280 --> 00:49:23.599


When we have meetings, we go over mission and values.00:49:23.760 --> 00:49:27.280


You you really start to explain the why behind these SOPs.00:49:27.440 --> 00:49:42.880


And all of a sudden, the SOPs came a bit became a bit obsolete and and redundant because people understood that our core value is to serve the guest or to think like an owner or to to you know to to support the local business.00:49:42.960 --> 00:49:45.599


Um, and then all of a sudden, like SOPs are still important.00:49:45.679 --> 00:49:50.159


You still gotta know how to do it, but they're but they're less important because you understand the substance and why behind it.00:49:50.400 --> 00:49:50.639


Right.00:49:50.719 --> 00:49:50.880


Yeah.00:49:50.960 --> 00:49:55.920


And that's huge because it's, I mean, really, you're just giving your people the autonomy to make decisions on their own.00:49:56.079 --> 00:50:16.880


And I think that's uh not only a confidence builder for them, but it also allows you to know at any given time your employees are gonna be making the right decision because that's what they should be thinking about in the forefront of their mind of like, you know, the owner comes first and you know, the reputation of the company and the brand, I mean, all those things, like however you look at it, um, it just helps you make the right decision in the moment.00:50:17.360 --> 00:50:17.840


Yeah, yeah.00:50:17.920 --> 00:50:22.719


We, you know, at Real Joy, one of the non-negotiables was is is do the right thing, right?00:50:22.880 --> 00:50:27.599


And and sometimes that is not in the SOP, right?00:50:27.760 --> 00:50:33.360


Sometimes that is a you know, it's a cancellation policy, but unf this has happened.00:50:33.440 --> 00:50:48.480


If you've been in the industry, this happens to anybody, but you know, the wife and husband are coming to town with their kids and cancer, you know, uh a cancer prognosis happens and like come now, and it's inside our cancellation policy, and sometimes you just gotta eat it.00:50:50.239 --> 00:50:51.920


Yeah, yeah, do the right thing, exactly.00:50:52.880 --> 00:50:54.400


And that's not gonna be an SOP.00:50:54.719 --> 00:50:55.920


That's not gonna be an SOP.00:50:56.079 --> 00:51:00.559


And then and generally everybody's watching you as a leader, right?00:51:01.039 --> 00:51:03.920


So if you do the right thing, they're gonna go do the right thing too.00:51:04.239 --> 00:51:07.039


If you do the wrong thing, they're gonna go do the wrong thing.00:51:07.199 --> 00:51:10.400


You know, Tom on our team always says like culture is what you tolerate.00:51:10.480 --> 00:51:25.679


And and so these, so like while SOPs are super critical to to to to document how to do things, it's really critical to to develop the you know, the heuristics and the culture and the brain to to go, we we just do the right thing at real joy, period.00:51:25.760 --> 00:51:27.119


That's and that's that's the wrong thing.00:51:27.199 --> 00:51:28.400


So we're not we're not gonna do that.00:51:28.639 --> 00:51:30.079


That's that's good to instill in your people.00:51:30.159 --> 00:51:36.159


And I think, you know, when you're taking over so many different areas, what might be right here might not be right somewhere else.00:51:36.239 --> 00:51:41.039


And and you need to have the the team needs to have that ability to pivot based on the market needs.00:51:41.119 --> 00:51:46.559


And I always tell people in my consulting, it's like, you know, you need to be what the market needs you to be, not what you want it to be.00:51:46.719 --> 00:51:50.000


And and that comes from just being flexible in in all those areas.00:51:50.159 --> 00:51:58.880


And I was curious, um, you know, moving forward, what is what do you, what is like strategy look like for a way day in terms of growth?00:51:59.039 --> 00:52:02.079


You know, what are you seeing in the industry that you think isn't being addressed?00:52:02.159 --> 00:52:05.440


Like what are all the things that away day is really outside of AI?00:52:05.519 --> 00:52:07.199


Because I think that's top of mind for everybody.00:52:07.280 --> 00:52:11.440


Like, what are things that you're really mindful of for like 26 and 27?00:52:12.079 --> 00:52:13.920


Yeah, the things we're spending all our time talking about.00:52:14.079 --> 00:52:28.159


I mean, it is, it is, you know, we we have a you know, we have a business model and and that is um, you know, partner with great businesses, grow inventory, retain inventory, you know, which is rather retain than grow.00:52:28.400 --> 00:52:30.719


Um, you know, expand same sports sales.00:52:30.800 --> 00:52:34.559


So our if you have a home in our program, we expect, it's an expectation.00:52:34.639 --> 00:52:37.280


It's not a you know, we're not praying for it.00:52:37.360 --> 00:52:41.280


Like we expect for that property to earn more dollars on our program next year than it earned this year.00:52:41.440 --> 00:52:47.840


We wanna, you know, and we wanna be able to provide, we want to have better margins in our business each year because it scales and grows.00:52:47.920 --> 00:52:50.079


And like those, that's that's what we do every single day.00:52:50.239 --> 00:52:52.719


The way that we do that is talent and technology.00:52:52.960 --> 00:53:10.159


And I think we've spent a lot of time talking somewhat about technology, but you know, you can probably hear it in just how we think about the business and people, but like talent is if we're not talking about technology at the leadership level and we're not talking about owner retention, we're talking about talent, which which covers all of those things.00:53:10.320 --> 00:53:18.639


And so we spend a lot of time, you know, at when when Real Joy, when we was just just RealJoy, we had, you know, called 125 employees.00:53:18.800 --> 00:53:28.159


I knew every single one of their names, I knew their spouses' names, I knew were their kids' names, and and that gets a that gets really difficult to do when you have 1500 plus employees.00:53:28.239 --> 00:53:42.159


And so you've got to build and and what what that meant is you knew how to promote people and provide career pathing and trajectory in the business and um and and create pathways for people to grow and take on more responsibilities and really develop them.00:53:42.320 --> 00:53:48.639


And so what one of the things we're talking about a lot at away day is is how do you do that at scale?00:53:48.800 --> 00:53:50.800


What type of systems and processes do you need?00:53:50.960 --> 00:54:01.679


How do you create career paths for people, you know, of all skill levels to come in and get better and have um a you know a longer uh and more prosperous time, time with the business.00:54:01.840 --> 00:54:03.920


Um, and we we've got a lot of things in work.00:54:04.000 --> 00:54:09.119


It's it's a it's an exciting time there, but we are spending a lot of time talking about talent.00:54:09.280 --> 00:54:14.320


Um, you know, something we repeat internally is good people provide great people provide great service, right?00:54:14.480 --> 00:54:17.360


And so if you want to provide great service, you gotta have great people.00:54:17.599 --> 00:54:19.280


And um, how do you find great people?00:54:19.440 --> 00:54:22.239


You gotta attract them, you gotta recruit them, you gotta retain them.00:54:22.480 --> 00:54:28.000


And um that's that's something it it's probably not maybe, maybe on this podcast a lot.00:54:28.079 --> 00:54:28.559


Maybe it is.00:54:28.639 --> 00:54:31.760


I I'm not sure, but that is that is a big part of our our focus.00:54:32.079 --> 00:54:34.400


Yeah, but people are everything, you know, at the end of the day.00:54:34.480 --> 00:54:39.119


The AI is gonna be able to help in a lot of ways, but having the right team is is critical.00:54:39.280 --> 00:54:42.960


Um, I've got one more tactical question for you before we wrap up.00:54:43.280 --> 00:54:50.159


Clearly, business development and growth is is a strength that you had a real joy and that you're now deploying across these other companies.00:54:50.400 --> 00:54:56.719


Any tips for companies that are, you know, trying to figure out how they actually go out and acquire more homes to be on their program?00:54:56.800 --> 00:55:03.119


Because I I think there's a different ways of doing it, but you know, some people have a lot of success with it and others really struggle.00:55:03.440 --> 00:55:14.480


One of the hardest things I think about building a business is um trusting other people to do as good of a job or better job than you do in those roles.00:55:14.639 --> 00:55:20.159


So um, and if you if you are one of the 55 businesses partners that we've partnered with, please please ignore this.00:55:20.239 --> 00:55:24.320


But like every single one of them is the best business development person ever, right?00:55:24.480 --> 00:55:32.559


And um and and if you go and talk to any local business, you know, they'll tell you things like, um, I close every deal that I'm on, right?00:55:32.719 --> 00:55:37.599


Or they'll say, uh, and and they said, just you just put me in a room and and we'll we'll we'll get the property.00:55:37.679 --> 00:55:39.119


And that's probably true.00:55:39.440 --> 00:55:41.920


But what happens is it's just not scalable, right?00:55:42.000 --> 00:55:54.000


And if you if you've got to pick between three things, you know, taking care of your family and um or or taking care of an escalated on-fire issue, or going and meeting a new property and bringing them on the program.00:55:54.159 --> 00:56:02.000


Sadly, a lot of entrepreneurs hunt on that third one, which is the one that really drives long-lasting value to the business.00:56:02.239 --> 00:56:07.599


Um, we used to say this a lot at RealJoy, like people would ask us, like, you know, how are you growing so fast?00:56:07.679 --> 00:56:10.800


And and they didn't love the answer because we'd say we answer the phone.00:56:12.079 --> 00:56:15.920


Yeah, just a simple thing, but it's it's not so simple actually.00:56:16.159 --> 00:56:28.400


And if you if you all have consulted companies and or or talked to companies that are growing, you know, one of the things they say is like, if you're talking to a new owner trying to find a place for their home, oh, I'm glad you answer the phone.00:56:28.559 --> 00:56:34.960


And oftentimes, you know, in the past, I was like, I don't know why anybody misses a business development phone call.00:56:35.199 --> 00:56:40.960


Because, you know, I know what that thing does for us personally as a family, and like we're not gonna miss that phone call.00:56:41.199 --> 00:56:45.519


And so so, so that's like if you think about that, this that's the framework, that's the structure.00:56:45.679 --> 00:57:02.079


And so the two things I probably just said is is find really great sales talent and put them to work and trust them to do a great job for you and give them a blueprint and a and a box that they can operate in and let salespeople go.00:57:02.239 --> 00:57:10.800


And as you all know, if you've been around salespeople, the best ones are a little bit messy, maybe unorganized, but but maybe just let them run, they'll do a great job.00:57:10.960 --> 00:57:12.719


Um, so that's like that's like one.00:57:12.800 --> 00:57:22.559


And and the second one is is have faith in your scaling business to deploy your resources and you know, to reinvest in the business in those key positions.00:57:22.800 --> 00:57:30.079


And then like we have a ton of tactics like outbound mailing, emailing, uh, you know, SMS, cold calling.00:57:30.239 --> 00:57:31.679


We're doing a ton of things.00:57:31.840 --> 00:57:40.000


I think I think the you know the the the number three lead source in our business is is uh for BD is uh contact fill forms.00:57:40.079 --> 00:57:47.440


So the team's doing a great job of of of of making sure our our our our companies are visible on the internet and and the keywords are there.00:57:47.679 --> 00:57:52.880


And so there is um and I I and then so that that's that's one side of it.00:57:52.960 --> 00:58:03.119


I'd say like the things that we repeatedly do, and and Brooke from Venturies probably would smile at this one is like people give up too soon on business development, you know.00:58:03.920 --> 00:58:04.400


Exactly.00:58:04.559 --> 00:58:08.400


They send out one postcard, and if they don't get a return from it, it's not working.00:58:08.639 --> 00:58:13.760


And and you know, I I sent like you'll hear this like, yeah, we sent a thousand postcards and we got three calls.00:58:14.000 --> 00:58:16.719


I'm like, that's phenomenal, you know.00:58:16.960 --> 00:58:21.760


You know, like did you close those three calls or what do we got to do to close those three calls?00:58:21.920 --> 00:58:23.920


You know, but they don't do it enough.00:58:24.079 --> 00:58:33.760


And oftentimes, um, you know, when an owner, and maybe you all have been in the situation, when an owner finally calls you or or the schedule meeting, sometimes you show up and they have 10 of your postcards.00:58:34.400 --> 00:58:36.559


They have like 10 postcards of yours, right?00:58:36.800 --> 00:58:37.280


Yeah, yeah.00:58:37.360 --> 00:58:39.840


They they've just been waiting for that right time, you know.00:58:39.920 --> 00:58:50.800


It's like it takes that consistency and you never know when uh somebody could be getting your postcards, and then that day something happened with their management company and they're just like, I've had it, I'm gonna call these guys.00:58:51.599 --> 00:58:52.800


So I think they just give up.00:58:52.960 --> 00:59:00.000


I think they don't support it enough, and they they they they maybe have the wrong mentality about what success looks like.00:59:00.079 --> 00:59:10.880


And and I I think um I think things like postcard mailing is very, you know, uh comparable to you see it attribution in other places, right?00:59:10.960 --> 00:59:16.000


Like an example might be like, well, my my neighbor told me about this business.00:59:16.239 --> 00:59:29.519


And and then when you dig in a few layers deeper, it was like, well, you got a mailer, you're considering leaving, you asked your neighbor who's already with us, you know, uh about us, and that's how we got the business.00:59:29.599 --> 00:59:34.079


Um, when really what happens, it was it was a postcard mail or something like that that got it going.00:59:34.559 --> 00:59:36.079


Yeah, yeah, yeah.00:59:36.159 --> 00:59:42.880


The attribution is tough sometimes, but yeah, definitely embracing that bigger mindset around it is key for sure.00:59:43.280 --> 01:00:10.480


And I always say that um one of the things kind of back to your like your team is that the entire team, regardless of what piece of the business that they're touching, they need to be bought in on what the business is about because those maintenance guys are running into owners when they're running into lows to buy something, or the housekeeper is talking to another housekeeper that works with an owner that, you know, maybe they're cleaning it as a contractor to the owner and the owner needs needs more help.01:00:10.639 --> 01:00:14.000


I mean, your whole team is touching so many pieces of the business.01:00:14.079 --> 01:00:21.119


It's like if they know the basics of what business development is and can have the basic conversations and they're gonna cultivate just as many leads too.01:00:21.199 --> 01:00:26.400


And I think that's where I come from, is I believe that like your entire team is part of your business development.01:00:26.559 --> 01:00:29.280


Now, what level that they're in, that's obviously different.01:00:29.360 --> 01:00:34.320


You're not gonna have a maintenance guy do contracting, but they can absolutely be out there doing leads.01:00:34.400 --> 01:00:39.920


And I think that's just you have to have your whole team bought in from, you know, from the lowest employee all the way up to the top.01:00:40.079 --> 01:00:45.920


So they are, you know, they're speaking and drinking and and exuding everything that the business is about.01:00:46.000 --> 01:00:52.400


So that owners, I I feel like they're they're naturally drawn to that when they see that everybody in the business is swimming the same way.01:00:52.639 --> 01:00:56.079


Yeah, we we stole this from Ritz Carlton years ago at RealJoin.01:00:56.239 --> 01:00:57.519


I I hope it's still in place.01:00:57.679 --> 01:01:02.960


Um, but just the rule that you can't not talk to anybody that's within 15 feet of you.01:01:03.119 --> 01:01:16.960


And and if you are an inspector or a property manager that's out in the field and you're in an elevator with somebody, you're wearing your company shirt and and you should have how's your vacation going, you know, um, where you're from, how you doing.01:01:17.119 --> 01:01:26.800


And the amount of leads that we get and the properties we close because of positive interactions with people wearing, you know, company clothing is is a ton.01:01:26.960 --> 01:01:29.920


It's I mean, for us, it's like hundreds a year, right?01:01:30.079 --> 01:01:32.480


Yeah, so so it's it's really impactful.01:01:32.719 --> 01:01:36.639


But but again, the attribution there is, you know, really difficult.01:01:37.360 --> 01:01:40.480


It's not always what you say, it's just how you make those people feel.01:01:40.559 --> 01:01:48.320


And if they feel like you're a good person, a part of a good company, then it's gonna get them excited to to to reach out to the company to figure out how to join.01:01:48.559 --> 01:01:48.719


Yeah.01:01:53.519 --> 01:01:53.840


Yeah.01:01:54.079 --> 01:01:54.559


Awesome.01:01:54.719 --> 01:02:02.000


Well, Jacob, this was such a pleasure chatting with you today and learning more about you and also just you know the mindset behind away day.01:02:02.079 --> 01:02:05.760


And I I think you guys have a really good initiative that you've put together here.01:02:05.840 --> 01:02:08.000


And we wish you a lot of success this year.01:02:08.159 --> 01:02:11.119


But um, are you going to any of the conferences?01:02:11.519 --> 01:02:12.559


I have no idea.01:02:12.639 --> 01:02:17.440


We we um I'm sure I'm sure I'm sure we'll have I know Jody will be at all of that.01:02:18.400 --> 01:02:24.559


Um like I said, I I'm by far not the most entertaining human that we've got in in in a way today.01:02:24.639 --> 01:02:29.199


And so there's there's plenty of more talented people that that should be on those stages than me.01:02:29.280 --> 01:02:33.199


Um, but but I I will try to join at least one of them to to support them.01:02:33.280 --> 01:02:38.079


I I believe Burma this year is in Nashville, and that's that's a pretty easy place for me to get to.01:02:38.159 --> 01:02:40.320


And so so I'll most likely be there.01:02:40.480 --> 01:02:41.519


Yeah, awesome.01:02:41.679 --> 01:02:46.719


Um, well, Jacob, if anybody wants to get in touch with you or learn more about away day, where should they go?01:02:46.960 --> 01:02:50.079


Yeah, um, there's a contact form on awayday.com.01:02:50.159 --> 01:02:51.440


Um I'm pretty accessible.01:02:51.519 --> 01:02:53.440


So Jacob at awayday.com.01:02:53.519 --> 01:02:56.639


Um if if you couldn't, that is is my contact information.01:02:56.880 --> 01:03:02.320


And uh yeah, yeah, we're happy to happy to pick up the phone and have a conversation with anybody.01:03:02.400 --> 01:03:05.360


So Jacob with a K, which is a little bit different.01:03:06.800 --> 01:03:07.199


Awesome.01:03:07.360 --> 01:03:12.239


Well, if anybody wants to get in touch with Annie and I, you can go to Alexandanipodcast.com.01:03:12.400 --> 01:03:14.880


And until next time, thanks for tuning in, everybody.